26 Responses for "Cut or no cut"

1. Chris December 14th, 2006 at 1:26 pm 1

   Yeah, this makes me rethink my basic opposition to childhood circumcision. I used to think that parents should approach circumcision and religion in the same way — let the children decide for themselves when they’re old enough. Still, I don’t know how I’d explain to my son that I lopped off part of his willie on the assumption that he’d grow up to be a sexually irresponsible moron, even if the statistical chances of him turning into said moron were fairly high at the time.

2. D M December 14th, 2006 at 1:53 pm 2

   I certainly don’t allow my circumcision to turn me into a sexually irresponsible moron.

3. Toftie December 14th, 2006 at 1:57 pm 3

   I am so torn over the circumcision thing. I grew up in a generation where almost all the men I knew were circumcised so that is what I’m used to and what seemed like the “norm” (I use that word loosely and mean nothing by it really). But now my friends who are new parents aren’t doing it and I think I heard a stat that the majority of newborns in Seattle are NOT being circumcised.

   Do we have a boy’s penis look like his father’s? Or do we have a boy’s penis look like his peers? Or do we make our decision based on not wanting to commit an act of cruelty if healthcare is telling us it doesn’t have to happen? This in and of itself is an interesting topic.

4. Chris December 14th, 2006 at 2:28 pm 4

   If it weren’t for these new STD statistics, I’d say there’s no way it’s ethical to circumcise, especially given what we know now about the huge number of nerve endings in the foreskin. Even with the new stats, I’m inclined to say no.

5. Kerry G. December 14th, 2006 at 4:03 pm 5

   Wouldn’t it be a lot cheaper (and less painful for the men) for the organizations contemplating subsidizing circumcisions to subsidize condoms?

   The whole article is pretty harrowing. I’m not sure how I feel about the study. While this information is good to know, people taking part got HIV. Now that seems unethical.

6. The Goat December 14th, 2006 at 4:20 pm 6

   We circumcised Jack for one simple reason: I don’t want the first person he has sex with to freak out when they see my boy’s junk. That’s a few therapy sessions just waiting to happen.

7. D M December 14th, 2006 at 6:09 pm 7

   You think someone’s going to freak out?

   I’m not saying your decision was wrong, but there’s oodles of amature porn out there with non-freaked out women and uncircumcised penises.

   I personally don’t think it’s something horribly barbaric has been done to me, so…

8. Aaron December 14th, 2006 at 7:09 pm 8

   Dr. Schwartz: Kyle. A-a circumcision is a very common thing for Ike to have. His father had it, his grandfather had it. And [pointing at him] his brother had it.
   Kyle: No! [Cartman and Stan gape] No, it isn’t true!
   Dr. Schwartz: We’re not going to cut it off! We’re just goin’ to snip it, so it looks bigger.
   Stan: [after he and Cartman wonder] Oh, hey, that doesn’t sound like a bad idea!
   Cartman: Heyeah, I want to get a circumstision, too.

   - Cartman 3:16

9. The Goat December 14th, 2006 at 7:12 pm 9

   I guess I need to increase my home-made porn intake

10. Kables December 14th, 2006 at 7:59 pm 10

    Isn’t this statistic a bit misleading? After all, if you don’t have sex with someone who has HIV, your chances of contracting HIV remain at zero — circumcision or no.

    I think the idea that a kid’ll freak out about his uncut dick when he realizes he’s different is completely overblown. Do you ever, EVER hear anyone telling the world how his foreskin made him miserable?

    As for the kid looking like his dad. I don’t know about you guys, I didn’t spend much of my childhood looking at my dad naked.

11. edgeplot December 14th, 2006 at 8:24 pm 11

    It’s not just the uncircumcised man who is at greater risk, but his partner(s) as well. And not just HIV. Uncircumcised men are more likely to catch any STDs their partners have, and their partners are more likely to catch any STDs the uncircumcised men carry. Furthermore, studies have shown that the female partners of uncircumcised men are also at higher risk of cervical cancer. There are also other potential complications from being uncircumcised, with a small (but probably unhappy) percentage of uncircumsized men experiencing difficulty urinating or attaining erection due to an abnormally tight foreskin, which can require corrective surgery. I say get it snipped.

12. D M December 14th, 2006 at 9:33 pm 12

    I have links…
    /laughs

13. D M December 14th, 2006 at 9:37 pm 13

    So…isn’t that kind of like ‘hey, if there are no bears, the bear patrol is working!’?

    I mean, yeah, if you don’t have sex, then your risk of getting any STD is zero. But most of us will, and thus become at risk for something. Even if you have safer sex, there’s still some risks. And in places like Africa, where the HIV infected population is close to 25% (Uh…I read that once, and I could be very wrong, ok?)…isn’t most any reasonable thing you can do to decrease the infection rate a good thing?

    Or…are you just fucking around, and I’m just missing the tone? I have a sneaking suspicion that’s the case, and I’m just being a dumbass…

14. D M December 14th, 2006 at 9:39 pm 14

    It would be cheaper, but there are 2 things standing in the way of this.

    1) changing a culture into one that uses condoms.
    This can be done. We did it-but we also had education systems in place to assist with this. Of course, it’s not perfect, but at least there is a culture that says: wear a condom while having sex.

    2) The Bush Administration, (or neocons, really) that insist that abstinance is good public health policy. Which is fucked up, of course, to the core.

15. Toftie December 14th, 2006 at 10:00 pm 15

    Wow. I had asked my friends who didn’t circumcise their sons what their doctors said about all these risks and the doctors implied they weren’t valid (but I think it was more like “as long as you learn how clean yourself properly, you’ll be okay”). I have to admit, even though I think girls won’t freak out since there’s the probability in about ten years that the majority of the boys they know are uncircumcised, I still think I would do it because I can’t help but buy what edgeplot says and who really wants to have to spend extra care cleaning themselves. Besides, where’s the spontaneous quickies in that life?

16. Kables December 14th, 2006 at 10:17 pm 16

    Sources, please.

    I’ve heard these statistics, and I’ve heard others say they’re false. Wikipedia offers a balanced view, giving some current figures, but also stating that the jury is still out. Not that I think you’re wrong . . . on the contrary . . . but this seems to be an area where so many fallacies are propagated or overblown (the whole hygiene thing, for example).

17. Kables December 14th, 2006 at 10:28 pm 17

    No, I’m not kidding around.

    The statistic is misleading, right? Or at least misstated — no context provided. I know what they’re getting at, but if you want to talk about bear patrols, the comparison is more logical when getting a circumcision is the bear patrol, not when it is staying uncircumcised. Like this:

    I’ve been circumcised
    I have not contracted HIV
    Therefore, circumcision prevents HIV

    I have a bear patrol
    There are no bears in the neighborhood
    Therefore, bear patrols prevent HIV

    I’m being a bit facetious, yes, and I understand that when having sex with someone who has HIV, being cut will reduce your chances of contracting. But come on, the BEST way to prevent HIV, or any other STI is to not have sex with someone with HIV. That’s the simple truth.

    As for Africa, perhaps circumcision should be promoted there . . . but there’s lots more we could be doing (thank God for the Gates Foundation!)

18. Kables December 14th, 2006 at 10:29 pm 18

    Someday, little man, you’ll wean yourself from the Victoria’s Secret catalog.

19. Kables December 14th, 2006 at 10:31 pm 19

    I hope I don’t come off as conservative, btw. I’m not promoting abstinence . . . I just see this study as a way for some misguided folks to run with a bandage at the problem.

20. Kables December 14th, 2006 at 10:34 pm 20

    I still think it should be a choice. I’m also against baby baptism, parents naming their kids, and force feeding Gerber pureed carrots.

    Kidding.

21. D M December 15th, 2006 at 8:39 am 21

    But come on, the BEST way to prevent HIV, or any other STI is to not have sex with someone with HIV. That’s the simple truth.

    The problem with the best way is that nobody does it. If you want to end all STI’s great-but the best way is obviously never going to work.

    I’d agree; 1) this merits more study and 2) you don’t want to say-hey, you can be a sexually irresponsible asshole if you’re circumcised, and 3) there’s a hell of a lot more to be done in terms of changing a culture that doesn’t use condoms, or thinks that having sex with a virgin will cure HIV, I’m not sure how misguided these folks are, considering how huge the problem is in Africa.

22. Kerry G. December 15th, 2006 at 9:08 am 22

    To promote circumcision there still would have to be a culture change. Why not focus on the cheaper, safer method?

23. D M December 15th, 2006 at 2:26 pm 23

    You’d have to ask the neo-cons. It doesn’t make any damned sense to me.

    Maybe it’s because circumcision has a very long history, it’s somehow more acceptable?

24. prbell December 19th, 2006 at 7:16 am 24

    Boy am I glad to hear that!

    Dad

25. Kables December 20th, 2006 at 9:26 am 25

    DAD! Get out of here! Gosh!

26. TonjaD January 14th, 2007 at 6:00 pm 26

    After reading Edgeplot’s comments I’m also leaning toward -cut it. I’ll admit that I haven’t seen an adult who is uncircumcised and my eyes might bug out a wee bit if I was exposed to one and wasn’t expecting it, so you could make a case for leaving it unaltered if you want to add the element of surprise to your sexual encounter. I’ve also noticed some guys don’t wash their hands after they pee, do we really expect them to spend sufficient time cleaning the end of their penis?